What are YOU hearing?
‘Religulous‘ is a satirical documentary produced by and starring Bill Maher and directed by Larry Charles. The film follows Maher as he visits religious sites around the world, interviewing people about God and religion. I have not seen the film, and don’t know that I will. The content of this film isn’t the point of this post.
I recently listened to an interview with Maher and Charles on NPR’s Fresh Air (download as a podcast here or listen on NPR’s site here). After listening, I interpret the film’s basic premise to be this: all religion is ridiculous and irrational and possibly dangerous. Despite my disagreement, it was incredibly interesting to hear Maher & Charles’ impressions of religion generally, and the Bible specifically. Here are a few excerpts from the interview:
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Terry Gross: Do you think in responding to religious extremism you’ve become like an anti-religious extremist?
Maher: I’m not an extremist at all. I believe in the doctrine of ‘I Don’t Know’ when it comes to the afterlife. And to say ‘I don’t know’ about the afterlife is really the only reasonable, and also humble, opinion you can hold. Anybody who believes in personal gods that are really the result of a long, 2000-year-old game of telephone–personal gods who you pray to and who perform miracles and fight with devils and so forth–that’s extremist…extremism. That’s extremely irrational. So I don’t think I’m the extremist, no.
TG: Did you read the old and the new testaments before making the movie?
Charles: Yes, actually, a number of times over the years. And again just before we made the movie. And we carried, of course, we carried all these holy books with us because we would cite things, cite quotes and so we were, we became pretty conversant in them..
Maher: I took a course in the Bible at Cornell when I was in undergrad….
TG: did you find anything in the old or new testaments that you thought, well this is actually beautifully written, or this is actually a really interesting thought that I should keep with me whether I practice religion or not?
Maher: The prescription against eating lobster, I think, is excellent. Because I don’t like lobster….
Charles: To me it reads like a Pynchon novel.
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You may or may not be having a reaction to these quotes. Again, there’s quite a bit more to be heard if you’d like to listen to it yourself (download or listen). I had a variety of reactions, ranging from sad to frustrated. But one of the final comments by Maher stopped me in my tracks. (Well… figuratively. I was on a elliptical machine at the time and, well, yeah…) This quote comes out of the continued conversation about impressions of the Bible:
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Maher: I mean, the New Testament is obviously different. The New Testament, if you strip away all the magic tricks and the bells and whistles and the nonsense, the message of Jesus is not only beautiful but revolutionary: the idea that the meek shall inherit the earth, and the poor and the powerless have just as much dignity as the powerful and the rich. That was a very new idea at the time, and it has not gone out of style, I might add. And It’s a wonderful message. It’s a shame it gets lost amidst all the other nonsense. (emphasis mine)
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Did you get that? A person who does not believe in God… who does not believe the Bible makes a case for needing a relationship with any kind of god… this person hears a nugget of truth in Jesus’ message. And wonders why the beauty of the message ‘gets lost amidst all the other nonsense’.
What’s the nonsense he’s referring to? Have we attached things to Jesus’ message that He never meant to proclaim?
What do YOU hear in the message of the New Testament?
What do YOU think is getting lost?
What do YOU think could be done about that?
Wow. I have been pondering your post all morning. Honestly, it convicted me quite a bit. Mr. Maher has so many views with which I strongly disagree and I wouldn’t even think of listening to an interview with him. As seems to be the human tendancy, I’d just written him off. But even he sees there is something beautiful in Jesus’ message. Light surely does dispell even the blackest darkness.
It makes me examine who in my personal circle of influence have I just “written off” and decided sharing with them would be a waste of time. Who have I deprived from even having an opportunity to see and respond to the beauty of Jesus’ message? I think a lot of what gets lost is the realization that the message is for everyone. God’s desire is for all to know Him. But we sometimes try to pick and choose who we are most comfortable with or who we think “deserves” His message.
Only God knows what the ultimate impact of the message will be on Mr. Maher’s life. I think we should most definately pray for him. Isn’t there some story about this guy named Saul who changed from being a persecuter of the church to being one of its greatest missionaries?
Russ… welcome and thanks for commenting. My point in writing this post is that I think it’s interesting what each of us are unwilling to hear out of scripture, to borrow your phrasing. I agree with you, that the cross is central to the message that God has for humanity.
tam… thanks, as always, for adding your thoughts. You’ve added some great pictures to what I was thinking when I wrote this post.
Ed Schief… I’m sure there’s some truth to your analysis of Maher’s motivation. And I did notice the conspicuous absence of reputable Christian leaders in the list of those interviewed for the movie. Again, his reaction to scripture just makes me think about what we ALL choose to ignore. Yes, Maher has dismissed as ‘nonsense’ that which is true about who Jesus was and what his death and resurrection meant. And that’s, as they say, the ballgame. :) It seems to me–as one who has grown up in the church–the ‘church’ ignores the part of Jesus’ teachings that Maher DID catch. We might go as far as to say ‘be like Jesus!’ … ‘show love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, etc’ …. but we don’t put the weight of the gifts and talents God has given us behind the radical message Jesus brought.
Jill xo… oh, my friend, I miss you so much! I’m sure it’s overwhelming to try to encapsulate how your experience in India is changing how you see lots of things. Thank you so much for commenting. What you’re seeing as the very real effect of the gospel… what you alluded to as ‘forces we are somehow very unaware of in the west’… it’s important for us –the Church in the west– to hear about that, as I think we forget the power that is very real and very much a part of all we say we believe. I love your second paragraph. Love it. Oh my gosh. Can we have coffee and talk about this!!?!?!
Besides being good conversation, just wanted to say that these comments are helping me further refine what I really think about this, so thanks to all of you for taking a moment to share them!
I love you and the mind that God gave you, Kim. Thanks for this post. The thing that I have become acutely aware of in India & having just read the book of John, is that Jesus didn’t come to make everyone feel comfortable and “okay” with themselves & they way they live… He is actually pretty harsh sometimes — no mincing words! It is hard to live in a place like this and to say to people “yep, I believe that there is truth, and that truth can be found in Jesus. Only. Period.” If we are honest, thinking people, we all find that one really hard to accept, because we don’t want to hurt anyone’s feelings or make them feel like we don’t respect them or love them… It is a really really REALLY hard one. And it’s hard to say in a way that doesn’t make non-Christians like Bill Maher (and many Christians, for that matter) bristle! But, what I have seen is that the gospel can provide hope & freedom & liberation… From forces we somehow are very unaware of in the west. I have one friend who describes her conversion as literally walking from darkness into light. BUT it wasn’t, and 20+ years on, still isn’t easy. She was rejected by her family, and friends, and sadly, hasn’t always found the support she needs in the midst of an abusive, alcoholic marriage amongst church people/leaders either… It gets back to people being people and that we’re not perfect, and we mess up… Regardless, she has kept her faith, and doesn’t give up. She sees something in Jesus that she knows she can’t get anywhere else, and she has been amazingly forgiving of humans, and continues to cling to Jesus, because she knows she has found truth and light.
People like Bill Maher, whether they want to admit it or not, are taking a leap of faith, just as we are. They are just choosing to leap in a different direction, I guess… I appreciate his ability to take on “the church”, and most of what he says about our shortcomings, I agree with, even though it is embarassing, and does raise my hackles because it’s not done with the intention of making us better, it’s done with the intention of ridiculing us. It’s frustrating that prophets like him generally don’t emerge from the Christian Community itself.
Overall, I agree with Tam who says that the Christian Community has messed things up. I see it here with Western Christians. I see it here with Indian Christians. I see it in myself… Yuck. I wish we could all go back to the basics. I read “More with Less”, and think, “if we all lived this way, it would speak volumes to others”… It really does get back to the golden rule, taking care of the poor, living humbly, living simply, being gracious, being willing to challenge ourselves, and sacrifice, being hospitable & generous — all very difficult things to do when the rubber hits the road, which, I think, is why it’s so easy to mess things up, and turn people like Bill M. off.
That just felt like a big run-on thought, so please forgive if it makes no sense. For goodness sakes, it’s Monday morning here.
I saw Maher with Jay Leno the other night. The man’s not interested in the truth–he’s interested in self-promotion. He’s the kid in the back of the class who just mocks everything. He searched out people who he and the director sensed would not be able to defend themselves well, and just plain picked on them.
Maher’s a smart guy, but you notice he didn’t pick on Rick Warren, or Billy Graham, or R.C. Sproul? He chose easy targets. As he talked with Leno, Leno started to disagree, and Maher didn’t listen–he just pushed back. Several times he said things that were pretty offensive. So offensive, in fact, that the usually-liberal Tonight Show audience actually grumbled and booed a little. Maher just put on his innocent face and said, “What? What did I say?”
Bill Maher needs to man up and stop being intellectually dishonest. He reads the New Testament and decides which parts to accept, and which parts are nonsense. Seriously–by what criteria does he make this choice? Jesus flat out claimed to be God, flat out did miracles, but Maher conveniently dismisses those parts.
C.S. Lewis said “You can shut Him [Jesus Christ] up for a fool, you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon, or you can fall at his feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronising nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.”
It seems plain to me that Maher’s dancing as fast as he can to keep from facing what he must know–that God will hold him to account.
We need to pray for him, but I don’t think we need to blame ourselves.
wow. thats intense.
i think the “christian” community (and lets not forget HOW MANY people call themselves christians) have thoroughly messed it up.
we’re shootin our wounded.
judging instead of loving.
forceful instead of gentle and humble (in terms of sharing the Word)
we stick in our little bubbles and “forget” about the world outside. the world Jesus said to go out into.
and we’re enforcing to much of our opinion of the Word instead of the WORD ITSELF onto people and its too mind boggling. (this last one i have just been seeing a lot of lately)
i hear in the NT….LOVE. Humility.
It is not so much what I hear that is important it is what the unbeliever is unwilling to hear that matters for the message of the New Testament is very clear. It is not difficult to understand. It can be summed up in two truths, both of which are clearly seen the cross of Jesus Christ. Yes, I know, we don’t want to talk about the cross but there it is, central to the Bible, central to history, and central to the message that God has for humanity.
The first truth that we see in the cross, and you are not going to like this, is that the cross of Jesus Christ testifies to the fact that mankind hates God. There is no way around this truth. God became a man and spoke the truth to man and performed various miracles of healing and love. He never did anything that was not true and good and wonderful and what was man’s response to Him? We killed Him. We brutally murdered the King of Kings and the Prince of Peace. Jesus Himself testifies to the fact the world hates Him. He says, “The world cannot hate you, but it hates Me because I testify of it that its works are evil.” [John 7:7]
But the second and much more wonderful truth that the cross teaches us is that in spite of man’s hatred of God, God does not hate man. In fact, it just the opposite. God loves man. In spite of all hatred and rebellion and brutality that we given Him, He freely sacrificed Himself for the sin of the world.
Jesus did not go to the cross unwillingly. He willingly offered up His own life for my sin and your sin. He willingly suffered in our place that we might have eternal life. Jesus said, “Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again. No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from My Father.” [John 17:18]
Jesus did not suffer for His own sin – He had none. Instead, He willingly offered up His life, a perfect sacrifice for the sin of the world.
Two messages, one cross. The hatred of man and the love of God.
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. [John 3:16-19]
Thanks, beth. I keep hearing this from lots of angles… the idea of stripping down the message of the gospel. Can’t keep from thinking about it.
Kim -
Awesome, awesome post. I saw Maher on tv the other night and though he’s mildly irritating, I respect his honesty and inquisitive mind. I am really stunned by the final comment you quoted.
That’s a lot for us to think about.
I do hope to see the movie, though I’ll probably hope for Netflix. Just like this post, I think it helps us answer the questions you pose at the end of your post. We do have to make an effort to understand how others see the church, or we’ll never be able to understand why they find us so irrelevant. And then the miss out on the kingdom of heaven.
Great post – excellent writing.